What should be the first dungeon in a RPG game?

[Lnik3500 13]

I was making a game, when I realized that I don't know what kind of dungeons to do at the beginning... do you guys believe there is a set theme for the first one like a cave or do you have other ideas of first dungeons?

Edited November 8, 2015 by Lnik3500

[markA 9]

I don't think there's a theme because it's totally depends on many things like your Character, Story, Background, World and etc.

 

Hunter's first dungeon would best be suited with his work which is probably forest

Pirate probably a treasure hideout cave thingy and etc.

 

You can even start an obligatory ice level in the first dungeon if the story fits.

[Lnik3500 13]

Then if it is a basic story ( the most cliché you could think ), what would be the first dungeon? if it is in a forest, would it be a cave or a temple at the side of a lake? I just want to know how should creative dungeons should be for the first one without feeling like a dungeon that could be later in the story...

[+ Chaosian 617]

It depends on the game. I detest trope-ridden dungeons by Greek element design to the core and think it was played to death 20 years ago, but other people will still accept them.

 

For good game design, I would start with something unconventional, and be big enough to make you feel accomplished - especially for first bosses. Having the first dungeon not being a dungeon at all would be a good start.

For cliché forest or fire are both very common.

Edited November 8, 2015 by Chaosian

[lonequeso 1,921]

Not knowing a single thing about your game the answer is literally anything. Anything you can imagine. That being said, you really need to narrow the question down a bit. What's the general story? What type of character is the main character? What genre? What time period? 

 

As far as difficulty goes, generally the first dungeon in games is fairly straightforward. In some cases they're essentially a tutorial. The player learns about the battle system, how to use/craft items, etc. The first dungeon in Ocarina of Time is a great example. Every five &$!@# seconds that damn fairy yells "Hey! Listen!" to tell you stuff. The dungeon teaches the player all the basics of the gameplay. That's one route you can go. If you're going to use puzzles in dungeons, put some simple versions of things the player will see later. Enemies are usually pretty easy to beat on a standard difficulty curve as is the boss. For the boss types, there's actually a couple threads in here that do into some boss types:

 

http://www.rpgmakervxace.net/topic/34736-unique-bosses/?view=findpost&p=241949&hl=boss

http://www.rpgmakervxace.net/topic/34096-boss-battle-design/?view=findpost&p=241556&hl=boss

[AskaRay 16]

By RPG law it's either a sewer or a forest.

 

Real answer- wherever the protagonist/party is at the moment. I mean if the party is starting in a huge city there better be a good reason they're traveling to the middle of a dank forest. Or if they're in the middle of a desert, etc.

You don't have to adhere to a set "dungeon"

[+ Takeo212 1,079]

If your game is set outside first;

 

A forest dungeon doesn't make to much sense to me unless it's the Lost Woods from LoZ. If you want a forest based dungeon, then perhaps ruins or a temple with forest decor?

 

What about a cave with many pathways? Final Boss is a mole who dug all the paths! A cave can be anywhere really, and can have variety of rocks and stuff, so creativity!

 

Sewers, a place with many rats and bats and great for beginner dungeons, unless your royalty, then the smelly dirty water probably isn't your favorite place to be.

 

Dungeon-esque jail breaks. Your friend or ally was captured and jailed? No problem, look behind the King's throne and find the trap door, go down 3 floors and you find the hidden jail!

 

Lava/fire caves are pretty cool if they fit. You can use lightining and effects to make the player look in awe. Also, having fire traps in places can be cool, and can inflict status and damage to the player when out of battle.

 

Water/ice dungeons. Same as Fire, but instead with a chilling atmosphere. Maybe getting a "frozen" state can slow you down in battle if you touch the water or get hut by a trap?

 

It all depends on the setting of your game. Old Fantasy? Sci-Fi fantasy? Medievil fantasy?

[xoferew 261]

Check out the village graveyard.  The old gravedigger's shovel broke thru to a tunnel.  No one will dare check it out because it's in a graveyard and also inhuman noises can be heard sometimes.  But now the kids who were playing "adventurer" are missing.  Maybe they're trapped down there?

[+ CVincent 234]

I don't really feel that there needs to be a pre-defined "first dungeon" that you should be making. Many games have followed a simple method of progression using elements as themes (as Chaosian mentioned), so why not break from the norm and do something new?

 

When designing a dungeon and how complex/balanced it should be you need to consider the following:

 

• At what stage in the game is the player at when they approach the dungeon?

• If the dungeon is available early in the game, what mechanics need to be introduced so the player can most comfortably adapt to the gameplay?

• What tools do you have at your disposal to allow the player to learn these mechanics?

 

I've talked a fair bit about how I used the Legend of Zelda series as my inspiration for game structure. There's a certain way they do things that when you think about becomes clear and repeatable like an algorithm. These algorithms can be applied to any stage of the game and allow for effective balancing and progression to keep the player constantly challenged and engaged. For example:

 

• The player is given a tool/weapon before they enter a dungeon. The dungeon is designed to make use of that equipment and tests the player's memory and intuition as they get further in the dungeon.

• The dungeon is not designed in a completely linear fashion. The player may need to use a tool or newly learned skill to progress to a new area that they may have had to pass by before.

 

Your first dungeon does not need to have any particular set theme within reason. Geography can play a big role in how you decide to plan your dungeons so consider where the player is at that point in time during the game.

[Yuugami 252]

Like what the people listed above, the first dungeon can just be whatever you want it to be. However, I'll list one interesting example you can consider, since you bring up the worry about "could this dungeon appear later in the game"?

 

 

Spoiler alert about SMT3: 

 

 

In Shin Megami Tensei 3: Nocturne, most people would assume the first dungeon is either the demonic space you awake, or the hospital you find yourself immediately afterwards. Normally, the way games work is that you progress through the world, and in SMT3, your final destination is the Kagutsuchi Tower. However, in what is considered the ultimate ending of the game, there is one more dungeon you must enter.

 

Upon reaching the very bottom of the dungeon, where do you find yourself?

 

Ding ding! That's correct, the very last floor of this final and ball-breaking dungeon is the demonic space you awake within in the beginning of the game. Depending on how you want to handle the story, backtracking through the dungeons just to end up in the place you started isn't necessarily a bad thing - it could almost be a major positive design decision.

 

 

[Rikifive 3,411]

There's no scheme of themes for dungeons, it depends on your game.

 

I'm pretty sure most of them were said already, but as for cliche games I think of:

- forest (wolves and such)

- plains near the city/village (wolves and such)

- very basic cave (rat wars, spiders and other thingies)

- mines (haunted with monsters ~ skeletons or rat/spiders etc.)

- severs (rat wars, spiders and other thingies)

- abnormally huge basement (because why not?; rat wars, spiders and other thingies)

- church (clearing town's church from skeletons etc. ~ evil forces)

- other 'bigger' building (clearing town's ... from monsters)

- graveyard (skeletons, zombies etc. ~ evil forces)

- town itself (NPC's hidden in houses and the town is filled with evil forces OR just some abandoned town)

 

(I know these are not 'dungeons' but I'm referring to 'dungeons' as a sort of 'level'.)

Some of them are one-time only, since they could be related more to a quest, rather than from simple dungeon.

 

If it's a cliche story, then for first dungeon avoid lava and similar themes. Leave them for later as they look more dangerous and stuff. Just use something very simple.

[Aria1573 21]

I worked on a project a few years back and our first dungeon was also the final dungeon of the game however it was only the first five floors. It was an flooded aquaitic dungeon with lightning based puzzles that could deal damage to your party. The main reason we decided to have the first dungeon be water based is because no one likes water levels so our thinking was if we design the first dunegon around a theme no one likes but we make it different enough from other water dungeons around and make the first dungeon also the final dunegon it would make it more memorable. It didn't work out well and in the end the project was abandoned but this idea has stuck with me since then. I decided to reuse this idea in my current project minus the final dungeon aspect.

[devonm0 37]

Like many people have said already, there's really no set formula or rule governing what the first dungeon is.  Also, if you want you can use lava or fire, but if it's going to be a hazard make sure to warn the player in the first area that is made hazardous by it.  Also, not necessarily limited to the first dungeon, but the beginning of the game should allow for acclimation to special features of your game.  I'm including this here because of how many games include the first dungeon in that 'tutorial period'.  Mind you there shouldn't be a lot of hand-holding, but maybe signs or stone carvings describing warnings or game mechanics.  Something where the player isn't forced to sit through drabble even during the 20th time playing the game (I'm looking at you Navi).

[Lnik3500 13]

I see! I always thought that there was a "set" rule for the first dungeon but it just depends on the context...

[StripelessTiger 4]

The idea of a first area for characters to be plopped into is really something that makes or breaks a game. In general you want something that teaches the player's the game mechanics without being boring or too difficult.

 

I prefer games that use exploration to clue you in to how things should work. In this manner, everything you encounter in the first dungeon should in some way teach players what to expect from then on, not exactly the same, but the general concepts you plan to throw at them.

 

However, the thing that irks me the most is having no fear of defeat. Linear tutorial dungeons that play themselves are very boring. In fact, negative reinforcement is a deterrent for players in order to teach them your gaming laws. Instead of constantly throwing textual information at them, give them an idea and let them run with it. If they fail, don't be too harsh on them, but at some point they have to sink or swim.

 

Sorry I don't have an specific dungeon ideas, but it seems that unconventional dungeons are more memorable. Formulaic RPGs, while easy to pick up, are by definition unoriginal.

[+ TBWCS 953]

The first dungeon you will and can have depends on where or what part of world you started at.

[amerk 1,122]

There's no real rule. However, the first dungeon should be a way for players to get acquainted with the game and learn its mechanics. Ways to quickly restore (potion drops or ease of going back to town) should be considered.

 

Personally, I hate sewers as the first dungeon. In most rpg's I've played, there's bound to be rats, and they're bound to somehow use some sort of stun attack (them being like a hundredth of your size and can still paralyze the player), and you are bound to be a single person party at this point with no way to prevent it, thus ensuring 4 or 5 rounds for a battle that should have taken 1 to 2 rounds... and if you face a group of 3 or more of these rats consider restarting the game, because they'll just spam their stun attacks until you're either dead or driven mad by the sheer boredom of waiting for your turn again.

 

I do have a thing for well-made forests, especially peaceful ones with upbeat music. I tend to favor them as my initial dungeon of choice.

[StripelessTiger 4]

Personally, I hate sewers as the first dungeon. In most rpg's I've played, there's bound to be rats, and they're bound to somehow use some sort of stun attack (them being like a hundredth of your size and can still paralyze the player), and you are bound to be a single person party at this point with no way to prevent it, thus ensuring 4 or 5 rounds for a battle that should have taken 1 to 2 rounds... and if you face a group of 3 or more of these rats consider restarting the game, because they'll just spam their stun attacks until you're either dead or driven mad by the sheer boredom of waiting for your turn again.

 

This ^

 

However, The Curse of Kiseki (aka Trails in the Sky) has a Sewer as the first dungeon. So they aren't all bad.

[amerk 1,122]

Yeah, not all bad. As horrible as many consider the game, Beyond the Beyond on PS1 actually had a pretty decent sewer dungeon. Of course, it wasn't the first dungeon, either, but still. One of the few areas I did enjoy, if you can get around the high encounter rate.

 

In fact, that game would have been much better if the encounter rate was lowered. It had some of the best puzzles I've seen in an RPG, next to Zelda (which I know isn't really an rpg and Wild Arms).

 

And for the worst sewer I've ever played, my hat goes off to Xenogears. My all time favorite game, but how I loathed that sewer.

 

Anywho, off topic. Anything can be a first dungeon. What matters is how you design it.

[KainLightsworn 63]

I'll second what other people are saying about the subject: base the dungeon off of where your party is close to and your narrative. Make it make sense for the context of the game. ie don't go sending your party into a dangerous erupting volcano if there aren't any volcanoes anywhere nearby and there is literally no narrative reason that makes sense in any universe for them to do so.

 

Also don't feel like you have to have dungeons early in your game for the sake of having dungeons. If anything will take people out of the flow of your game, it's shoehorning in dungeons.

[lonequeso 1,921]

I must be playing the wrong RPGs. I've rarely played one that had a sewer for a dungeon. I'm pretty sure every Ninja Turtles game I've played had a sewer level though. It's perfectly fitting in those games. So as I and everyone else said, the first dungeon you have should have some relevance to where the players are and what's happening. If you don't have the beginning of the story yet, make that first, and you'll have a much better idea of what to do.

Edited November 20, 2015 by lonequeso

[xoferew 261]

Most "sewer" dungeons seem to actually be water delivery systems.  Rather than you know, sewage.  Don't make one with actual sewage.  Especially for a first dungeon.  And that's my advice.

[lonequeso 1,921]

Lol.  Aqueduct dungeon? I just realized one of my cites will have a sewer. I was going to have a rebel base hidden there, then I realized Fable 3 did the exact same thing.  (so did the NInja Turtles) So, no hidden sewer base. I'll put it somewhere else. I'll have at least one side-quest that makes you go into the sewer.