Too many skill choices?

[Lord Vectra 414]

Is there a such thing as too many skill choices?

There are some things I love about databasing... and skills is one of them.

 

Currently I have roughly 454 skills. Now, you don't have all 454 skills but if a player had, like, 100, would that be ok?

Asking because I am redoing certain parts of my skill system, and there will most likely be an increase in the number of skills one actor has, and I'm wondering when there can be too many choices to choose from (this is assuming all the skills are unique and useful).

[Kayzee 4,032]

It really depends on how much you need to fiddle with the skill menu really. I don't think there is ever anything inherently wrong with giving the player more options, the problem always seems to me like it's more about how effective the interface is at presenting and selecting those options. How many categories of skills are there? How many skills are in each menu? How many skills are just more powerful variants of other skills? How are skills grouped in the menu? Are the menus laid out in a way that makes scrolling through skills efficient? Does the menu remember where it is so you can quickly repeat an attack? Could it be possible to make sub-categories to further organize skills? Could you make it so you can select different levels and/or targeting options for a skill rather then have a bunch of related skills that use different ones? Those are the types of questions I would ask.

[Lord Vectra 414]

I kind of don't feel like answering all of them. I'll just say there are AOE v. one target variants (AOE does half dmg, however). Grouped by magical and melee. There are stronger variants in case u dont want to waste MP/ST in certain situations and there is a cooldown/warmup which higher-end spells have a cooldown and possibly a warmup as well.

[lonequeso 1,921]

I'd say probably 20-30. It depends on how long the game is, how  unique the skills are, and how they're acquired and organized. 100 seems pretty steep even if the player can ever unlock a fraction of them in  a single play through. With 100 skills, some are bound to be redundant. You don't need three different Fire spells with similar damage and targeting. You also don't need skills that become obsolete as the player levels and gains better ones. Good scaling with the damage formula and skill cost can allow those early skills to still be effective. Less power, but

still can do enough damage e to be worth it  as well as having a lower cost. Perfect for those situations where the player needs to manage skill points as well as when the job can be done with a bullet instead of a nuclear missile. 

 

That scaling alone will make it unnecessary to have a multitude of skills. There is such a thing as too much micromanagement. Having little wrinkles in skill effects and targeting can be useful, but at some point you just end of with a bunch of skills that are basically the same, and there's really no clear tactical advantage between them. If you're using a skill tree ,newer RPG players may also become frustrated when they realize they've wasted skill points on a clone. 

 

Finally, how cluttered are the menus going to be? Say there's 100 skills per actor, and the player can only ever access 50 of them through a single playthrough. So far it sounds like you have just two menus. That's 25 skills in each. That's seems like it'd be overwhelming for a lot of people. I love RPGs for the strategies and customization, but realistically, I'm only using a handful of those based on my play style and everything else is just clutter. I was actually playing a game like that. One of the actors had a Blue Mage type skill where she could learn both other party members and monster skills. Her skill menus are pretty cluttered and I usually only use a handful of those skills. Adding more menus can make things too complex, too. It's very wishy washy with that many skills, and, again, you probably could get by with a lot less of them.

[Guyver 65]

Depends how much clutter there over the course of the games progression. I like hiding some skills once upgrades are available, but leaving some like basic level spells to give the players the option to use lower cost ones when in lower level areas. The most skills I have on one of my job classes is somewhere around 60  because it's basically a blue mage.

 

Then again, I'm one to talk because I have somewhere around 1500 skills in my game and had to break the database. :|

[Kayzee 4,032]

6 hours ago, Lord Vectra said:

I kind of don't feel like answering all of them. I'll just say there are AOE v. one target variants (AOE does half dmg, however). Grouped by magical and melee. There are stronger variants in case u dont want to waste MP/ST in certain situations and there is a cooldown/warmup which higher-end spells have a cooldown and possibly a warmup as well.

 

Hehe, I didn't mean for the questions to be really answered by you, I just think they are good questions to get in mind is all. Just think about how tedious it is to select and use the skills is all I am saying. You do that and you will be fine. :3

[Perang Cemen 188]

If you ask me...

one actor need at least 500 skill.

why? (you may ask)

Because I'm crazy!

 

Don't open this if you're not crazy enough like me.

Spoiler

I have 10 project that I just fill Database part but I haven't make maps, event, and such.

Why?

Because when I do my project something nice idea come up, I don't want to lose it so I make a empty project and fill database with that idea, and I ended up have so many untouched project, shit... I have go see doctor.

 

[Kayzee 4,032]

Hehe, wow, even highlighting the skill I suggested. :3

[Perang Cemen 188]

Oh yeah that database now have 6821 skills, I was planning to have 10000 if database won't break of course...

(But have that much begin to cause lag when open skill command/skill menu, probably I'll limit it or find anti lag script that allow database to be loaded first with cost of ram, yeah...)

PS: I lazy to take another screen shot so I use the old one, yeah...

[+ Abscond 149]

Are the skills unique? By unique, I mean they do different things like damage, status effects, cooldown, etc. I've seen skills that were just copied from another with slightly more or less damage output. The skills have to be meaningful or else the player won't use them and thus would be a huge waste of your time.

 

Around 20 skills seems reasonable as long as each skill provides a different (and significant) outcome when used.

 

In my project, we're aiming for the protagonist to have around 10-15 skills. Each entirely different from one another. Also, each skill can be leveled up to 3 or 5.

[freakytapir 55]

Personally, most characters in my game will get about 15 skills

Single target

Multitarget

Single target+Effect

Multi Target + Effect

________

* 2 because each character has about 2 elements.

And also :

Defensive skill

Utility Skill

Healing skill

 

There is no fire 2 or fire 3. There is fire, scorch, fireball and there is inferno. They all deal the same damage, and maybe a status effect.

Edited May 22, 2018 by freakytapir
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[Lord Vectra 414]

Thank you for the extra input. I plan on redoing some of WOC (World of Chaos) skills because I did it wrong (at least, I think so). What you say just reinforced that I probably need to redo some, so I will lol

[jamesdomus1861 8]

On 2/12/2018 at 1:53 AM, Lord Vectra said:

Asking because I am redoing certain parts of my skill system, and there will most likely be an increase in the number of skills one actor has, and I'm wondering when there can be too many choices to choose from (this is assuming all the skills are unique and useful).

 

I guess it depends on what kind of game. I found the lack of choices in Dragon Age (really, a Warrior can never learn how to pick a lock?) acceptable, but in Elder Scrolls games, I love the openness and the fact that you can learn everything if you so choose.

 

So, for me, it depends. In an immersive narrative story, I don't feel the need for as many choices, but in an it's all in your head kind of game, I need something to keep me engaged.